@RPU_mike

Long rebuttal since as a mod I'm being labeled as "pushing purple pill" so i have the need to clarify

First of all, in my comment i said this:

(not the best word choice of mine to describe it there)

To clearly acknowledge that my comment was shorthand and not well phrased. Durek put a lengthy response and i didn't want to come across as ignoring it so i responded quickly and led with that disclaimer.

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That being said I'm not pushing purple pill anything at all. Where did i say alpha (high test) behaviors were not preferable to women? Also where did i urge the notion that individual men are on a spectrum as indicated by your normal distribution comment? I did not at all unless you can quote it, this is a heavy misinterpretation of what I was saying. Men are made from a complete collection of ALL of their behaviors so in no way shape or form was i discussing men as a spectrum. I believe men can be classified into alpha or beta categories with alpha being better obviously.

If a high test Chad (which is obviously better) texts a woman back immediately and also double texts on occasion Is he a beta immediately because of it when 90% of his other behaviors are high test? No. Is texting back immediately more beta in isolation though and not a good sexual strategy to use? Yes. Would you consider that man a beta male though when 90% of his other behaviors are high test? That was largely over half of my original point. Do you disagree with that? If so, why?

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Let's say a woman disrespects you overtly. A full beta (low/no test) behavior would be to break down crying in losing all composure and begging for forgiveness. A less beta but still beta behavior would be to apologize and supplicate some/DEER around. A middle ground reaction would be possibly making a brief unemotional but still DEER quip (none of which are desirable responses on that spectrum at all).

Are you disagreeing that behaviors can be measured by their alpha and beta values on a spectrum? If so, why? Can you not measure them on a spectrum? Otherwise one beta behavior would be no different in severity from another.

In your own example you mentioned a normal distribution. You could not derive a normal distribution of testosterone unless there was a range (spectrum) of testosterone values. Otherwise you would have a logarithmic scale (beta = 0 and alpha = 1) not a normal distribution. So why would you not be able to quantify alpha and beta behaviors on a spectrum?

Are you hard disagreeing on how to meaure the degreedness of alpha and beta in isolation?

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As for the rest of my point I was trying to make, you have men deliberately doing the most socially uncallibrated "alpha" as possible things in game because they think the situation calls for some kind of complete alpha dgaf vibe. Higher test behaviors are definitively more preferable but my entire point of the "spectrum" notion is that going full alpha Rambo is counterproductive and will result in a high percentage of blowouts. As a man you cannot run off maximum test in a social world. Most behaviors and social interactions require a semblance of rapport and not full unadulterated amoggery in your interactions with women.

So if you, as a man, are displaying a clearly high test behavior, but the behavior or specific trait is not full unadulterated alpha (because there is some element of rapport in your behavior or holding back of what you wanted to behave, that yes, it is a behavior that is on a spectrum (BUT STILL ALPHA/high test)

That was the entire crux of my point. I'm not sure what we actually even disagree on other than that i believe you can quantify alpha and beta behaviors on a sliding scale within the categories of alpha and beta, whereas, at least from how your point is worded, that it must purely be one or the other.

We might be disagreeing that there is an optimal level of alpha to have but I'm certainly NOT articulating that high testosterone behaviors AREN'T better. I'm saying high test behaviors are CLEARLY better, but that they need some semblence of rapport in a practical world (which noobs frequently butcher). Something like a behavior being 85% alpha and 15% rapport (beta if you one considers any degree of rapport whatsoever to be classified as strictly beta)

In light of my clarification where do you hard disagree or disagree at all? And where am i advocating whatsoever a purple pill position when I am in full advocacy for displaying high test behaviors and traits? My only contention is that full unadulterated alpha is impractical. You seem to be assuming i meant men must be 50/50 alpha/beta and i did not.

@Elvis

Okay so it seems like you are conflating testosterone therapy and test boosters.

Testosterone therapy is injecting roids (synthetic testosterone) to give you normal or above normal testosterone levels.

TRT= steroids but at normal doses.

Test boosters are different. Some are snake oil, some are real deal but all they do is boost your NATURAL testosterone levels.

Test boosters aren’t forms of synthetic testosterone.

www.healthline.com/health-news/men-too-much-testosterone-linked-to-shorter-lifespan-112213#:~:text=new%20research%20shows%20that%20men,%2c%20concentration%2c%20and%20muscle%20mass.

Do you honestly think people are suffering from high test these days?

Test levels have been decreasing 1% EVERY year for the last few decades.

Since 1950, t levels are almost halved. Many factors here at play.

Some obvious and some not so much. Eg obesity, environmental toxins, plastic, sedentary lifestyle compared to our grandads who had to do a lot more labour based work.

Our grandads at age 20 had more test than we do at 20.

Just like there’s a societal war on men, there is a Chemical war on men as well.

The medical field, similar to how feminists demonise men, have demonised testosterone and exaggerate the negative side effects of it.

They have moved the bars of healthy testosterone down from 309ng/dl-1200 Ng/dl to 200ng/dl-900ng/dl.

These doctors lie to young men and say their low levels of testosterone is normal.

And the educated men have to fight tooth and nail to get put on TRT when they clearly need it. And then if the doctor gives in, they still need to fight to get a good level of test rather than just average or below average.

Tons of stories of this shit happening.

Many test doctors are shit, they don’t want to help their patients have solid test levels.

Research testosterone on trp, r/testosterone as well.

Even give illimitable man’s last post a read.

He made a post on going on testosterone therapy and how many doctors don’t know their shit when it comes to this.

@Kloi

Do Men Shit Test Women?

Do men shit test women? If so, how are they similar and how do they differ from women's shit test for men?

Men talk shit and fuck with each other all the time for fun. Iron sharpens iron in a game of verbal jujitsu and yes when emotions get hot this can be used to crack or test a real opponent. Not really shit tests in the way I understand them. Mainly it's just for sport.

I do the exact same with the women in my life and most of them enjoy it until they don't anymore. My girls even crack jokes back. Not really shit test, more like a temperament test or gagging someone's wit.

The only thing that comes close would be a test of submission. Gagging how well she follows directions, values you as a leader.

More comparable to a comfort test from them would be simple things like asking her to grab a water for you, an item from the store while she's out.

Otherwise, if shits getting sticky, can she calm down her emotions and take instructions when the pressure is on. Fortunately my girl seems to follow my lead when emotions have gotten hot out and about.

So no, I don't necessarily believe men in general use shit test in a similar fashion as women.

And then suddenly, the theme song to The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy plays, as a Raccoon enthusiastically throws up the horns with both arms before gleefully exclaiming, "Always!"

@Kloi

Tongkat Ali (for test)

While technically Tongkat can have a mild effect for a few days. Taking this daily is bad news. Hormones run off of feedback loops. When you take something that acts like a hormone, your body responds by producing less, and this is made worse by the atrophy of the organs that produce it.

The big problem with Tongkat is that you can't take enough to function as TRT. If you're done with naturally produced test, TRT is an option, but you are going to be stuck on it for life. But you need be taking something that gives you a legitimate level of test.

Before you do something like TRT. Try to fix your hormones naturally. I assume you have low bodyfat and do heavy squats. Those are primary. Next is to measure your blood for Testosterone precursors, SHGB, and E3. If your estrogen is high or SHBG is high or precursors are off, fix those by adding carbs, losing fat, fixing your diet for more test percursors (boron, vit d, zinc, dhea, cholesterol, saturated fat) or aromatase inhibitors.

The next thing to look at is your Hypothalmic Pituitary Testicular Axis (HPTA). You have to be producing the right levels of Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone (GnRH), Luteinizing Hormone (LH), and Follicle Stimulating Hormone (FSH) to produce Test and Free Test.

Drop any supplements that affect test, and run a 12-week cycle of Tamoxifen 10mg/day. This will regenerate your bodies ability to produce these critical hormones and regrow tissues that may have atrophied. Wait 12 more weeks and do a hormone blood panel. If you aren't where you should be move to injectable test (oil or pellets, no dumb gels, 100-200mg/week) and be prepared to do them for life. You can use hcG(250-1000iu/twice-per-week) to keep your balls from losing about 10%-20% of their mass.

@Lone_Ranger

without all the shit testing, but that's just wishful thinking

Sorry to tell you man, but this is again wishing that your girl was a man and it lacks understanding of a shit test.

A shit test is a test of congruency and comes out of women when they feel sexually attracted to someone. A shit test is a GOOD thing. Passing shit tests is EASY. The difficult thing is to recognize every shit test as such.

A shit test is different from a wife or GF nagging. A shit test has a specific meaning. A terminology that OP here also did not use correctly.

When a girl starts nagging that’s NOT a shittest, it is actually her unconscious feeling that something is wrong displayed on a verbal (often incoherent) level. Nagging means “something is wrong, I don’t know what but I don’t feel good about this” a shittest means “I maybe wanna fuck you, let me check if you are the man you are pretending to be”.

Please guys, learn the terminology, don’t spew out TRP or PUA words just to seem in the huddle.

@AFTSOV

How does it usually go,

It frequently backfires, and the woman ends it.

and how did it go for you?

She had a shit-fit at the time, but behaved better over the course of the following months and years.

Also, my coffee hadn't kicked in yet earlier, so I didn't think about this before: this might be a shit test, or it might be a comfort test.

The best way to navigate this is to default to thinking it's a shit test and respond with agree & amplify ("yeah, I'll bring my harem over tonight. You can watch, if you like" for example). If she realizes she's being ridiculous and backs down, it was a shit test and you passed.

however, if she doubles down, starts crying, says things like "you don't take my feelings seriously!" after you A&A, it was a comfort test. This is the time to reassure her ("why go out for burgers when I have steak at home?" for example).

I'd go this route before what I said earlier. If shit test, then go with what I said earlier.

Kind of a weird one really.

Strong IoIs. I approach. Anxious asf. Immediately hits me with a shit test. Caught me off guard. Fumble the shit test. She smooths it over.

Build rapport with the group. She ignores me, only to hit me with a shit test every few minutes. After the 3rd fumbled shit test, I shit test her back about busting my balls, get a laugh from the group. Shit test her again.

Now she starts probing me with questions. But flip flops between ignoring me and asking questions. She starts to get a bit flirty but again this is then followed by ignoring me. Chat as a group for a while. They all then leave.

Hour later they come over to my table. HB8 sits directly opposite me. Doesn't speak to me, If I say something she ignores it. When she does speak, she speaks to everyone else in the group except me. But is making eye contact throughout.

Eventually they all go to leave. Everyone says goodbye except HB8. She just stands there making direct eye contact, then leaves.

I can't quite wrap my head around the ignoring, yet maintaining strong eye contact. Never encountered that before.